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CRFF Roundtable West Virginia: Loyal and True

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Proud and immortal. Bright shines your name. Oklahoma State. We herald your fame. Ever you'll find us. Loyal and True. To Our Alma Matter. OSU.

Brett Deering

Well this last week was something wasn't it? Passions were running high after the loss on Saturday, and the conversation that took place wasn't actually intended to be a roundtable session. It just sort of happened. All that's to say is this is pretty candid look at what goes on behind the scenes at CRFF. Hopefully you enjoy, and let us know what you think in the comments.

ME: "What's pissing me off is all the OSU fans that are jumping ship "for the rest of this year." I mean what the hell happened to Loyal and True?"

ROBERT WHETSELL: "Don't mistake "loyal and true for being willing to watch brutality when the coaches appear to be mailing it in to some degree in favor of preparation for 2015. We'll all be watching on Saturday, but they better show some life, or this ship will sink faster than the Titanic. For heavens sake, they still have only one loss in conference play. Show some fight."

KING: "Also it's possible to love OSU and the team but refuse to get pissed off and have your fall ruined watching shit product and low grade coaching. Also the more I think about it I'm glad Wickline is gone. He was some wizard coaching bad players but he recruited those players. We are in the situation now because of his recruiting misses.

CHRIS ROSS: "I'm with Tyler. In the OU vs K-State as told by the fans post, sooner fans talked about cancelling season tickets. I hope Cowboy fans never get to a point where after two losses, fans are walking away. If fans are seriously ending their support of the program, that's ridiculous.

Yes, the loss is hard to take, but only being a fan when it's easy is no way to live. We knew this was a team waiting to get exposed. It happened. Guess what? Inexperience matters. What did everyone want? To see perfect football that only managed to win eight games? Was that the expectation? I admit that eight wins seems like a pipe dream at this point, but that's mostly because TCU and West Virginia are much better than we thought. I do think the Pokes have a pretty good shot at beating the Mountaineers though.

There are several issues, but there's only one way to fix inexperience. There's no shortcut or magic pill. You just have to live with it. Awful game planning, and poor play calling is a certainly valid complaint, but even it's limited by what the team can offer. Everyone wants to see more out of the playbook, but does this really seem like a team that's got a firm grasp on what they're running now? Anyone have a lot of faith the coaches could throw in a lot of wrinkles, and everyone on the field would know what the hell was going on? It is what it is, but it's no reason to jump ship as a fan.

I have been going to games for 9 years now. This year has been one of the lowest turnouts I've seen. I park just a couple of blocks down Hall of Fame from the stadium, and the lot hasn't been more than half full all year. They even dropped their prices mid-season. I guess I'll see all the bandwagon, t-shirt fans next year when youth turn to maturity, and inexperience turns to depth. Until then, I'll enjoy my elbow room."

GERALD TRACY III: "I agree on that too. This team seemed to have completely given up Saturday. I don't get how people can do that to a team they claim to love. I'm a Viking, Rangers and OSU fan, sucking for a year or two (or more) happens but that doesn't mean it's time to give up."

CORY TREECE: "I agree with a little bit of what you said, but this Saturday was the first time in a very very long time I've seen an OSU team completely give up on a game. It was obvious by the body language on the sideline.
I won't jump ship. I remember what it used to be like being a very mediocre team year in and year out. I agree there are some very bandwagon type fans. Every school has them. We grew immensely as a fan-base with success, and a lot of those fans that came on board were doing it in 2010 and 2011.

My frustration is with the coaching staff. It's not just Yurcich anymore either. This team really just doesn't seem to show any character when they get knocked down and that is reflected by the coaching. They are at crossroads right now after 2 (really almost 3) straight absolutely terrible performances, and they could really turn things around with a win against a really good WVU team.

I think there will be a great turnout for Homecoming like always, and the home-field advantage will be huge in this game. Let's hope the coaches do their job in getting the players to forget about last week, and start becoming the tough minded team we are all used to seeing.

On a side note, not trying Mason out by the end of the season might be one of the biggest mistakes Gundy has ever made. There is absolutely no reason why we are trying to red shirt him at this point. He's basically sending a message that he would rather sacrifice trying to win than burning his red shirt. Absolutely dumb."

KING: "I think Lunt has forever ruined Gundy. But there's a big difference between throwing him out there to try and win and letting him play in garbage time. He could have played the entire 4th quarter last week. But historically quarterback issues are Gundy's kryptonite."

GUNTER SHARP: "You can still be Loyal and True and not want to watch the football games. "Loyal and True, to our Alma Mater O-S-U". You're staying true to the university, not necessarily binding a contract to watch their sporting events. No matter how sucky this team is, I'm still going to homecoming, I'm still going to the Texas game, and if I can bear the heartbreak, Bedlam. If two SEC teams are playing the game of the year while we are down 30 in Waco and the team has given up, I might change the channel.

It does suck that the coaches have thrown in the towel on this season. They have a very cancerous loser's mentality and it has transferred to the players. In 2011, being down 21-3 (I think) to A&M at half meant airing it out and winning the game. Now, we quit after a 21 point difference. Gundy admitted to playing a freshman walk-on at center to "build depth and gain experience". That's basically saying that he's playing for 2015. It's a pathetic attitude and very OSUish."

SCHULTZY: ""That's basically saying that he's playing for 2015."

Props to Gundy for being so forward thinking. It's smart, and it's  the right call."

GUNTER SHARP: "Our team was 5-1, 3-0 in conference, #15 in the country, and in control of our own destiny."

CORY TREECE: "That's a complete losers mentality to "play for 2015."

And Gunter is right. We only had 1 loss before Saturday."

GUNTER SHARP: "Mathematically, it's STILL possible to win the league. They have a loser's mentality if they play for next year. That's not fair to the Seniors."

SCHULTZY: "And did you think that was indicative of OSU's talent?"

GUNTER SHARP: "Anything is possible."

SCHULTZY: "I mean, sure...but that sure as hell doesn't mean it's likely."

GUNTER SHARP: "Likely or not, it isn't fair to your players."

SCHULTZY: "Meh. I'm much more concerned about Gundy sustaining his success. This was pretty much always a rebuilding year."

CORY TREECE: "1. Not fair to the players especially seniors. 2. As a coaching staff, they have an obligation to do everything in their power to try and win.

They packed it in midway through the 3rd quarter. It was clear to anyone watching the game. I'm more upset with that than the loss itself."

GUNTER SHARP: "Screw the redshirt. A QB doesn't have to play 4 years to be effective." (Talking about Mason Rudolph).

SCHULTZY: "They have every obligation to build a program, which is what they are doing."

GUNTER SHARP: "And is there a better way to attract recruits than getting wins? Which is why we aren't elite."

SCHULTZY: "This next class may be Gundy's best work and there's no negative effects yet. Will see next year if recruiting is affected at all, but I doubt it. He'll be able to pitch playing time and say "this many freshmen got significant playing time last year etc."

Does anyone think we're elite? I certainly didn't say that."

GUNTER SHARP: "I know you didn't Parker. I said that as a side note addressing anyone who does."

ROBERT WHETSELL: "We aren't elite, obviously, don't think anyone actually believed that, but the team is a lot better than the sums of its parts right now, and that's on coaching. I honestly think Gundy is very stubborn in moments like this, to the team's detriment. They've known the offensive line's issues all along, and they've done virtually nothing to take the pressure off them."

CORY TREECE: "Recruiting aside (I agree it won't have a major effect) you've still gotta try to win. You can't convince me its in the best interest of the future to not at least try something different.
You've got Kolar coming in next year. There should be no influence whatsoever about playing Rudolph."

GUNTER SHARP: "Rudolph deserves a shot I guess."

STEVE DODSON: "Was there any doubt after Gundy came out and said "no way Rudolph plays this year"?"

SCHULTZY: "'This team really just doesn't seem to show any character when they get knocked down'
I don't get statements like this. What does that even mean? They have one really bad game and suddenly they don't have "character?"

I'm completely fine with not playing Rudolph this year. Even with him, I doubt we'd improve that much to seriously alter how our season is going. This is a developmental year, but the team and program are still in fantastic shape going forward."

GERALD TRACY III: "I think the line has a part in Rudolph not playing. If he is as good as we think he can be, why risk his career to an ACL injury that could happen behind this ragtag team of a line."

CORY TREECE: "They showed no fight in the 2nd half is what I meant. Looked completely defeated. Not something that normally happens with a Gundy coached team. That's all I'm saying
I'm allowed to be critical and still be fan."

GUNTER SHARP: "It's one thing for them to try, get outplayed, get outcoached, and then lose, but they gave up entirely in the second half."

ME: "I wouldn't play Rudolph either. I think if we have gotten to this point and he is still in a redshirt then why burn it now?"

TAYLOR YORK: "Who would you rather play next year: true freshman, or freshman with a 4 losses and no wins, or a senior with a winning record? Sounds like you should start the senior to me. It would be very hard to start a guy with 4 losses over that senior. That's what you'll be asking yourself if you start Rudolph (Kolar being the true freshman)."

ROBERT WHETSELL: "All depends on what you want from the season.

The team has one loss in conference play and still has a chance to control its own destiny.

You are either playing to win, or riding it out. Championship programs don't 'ride it out' when you still have a shot to win the conference."

CORY TREECE: "I second what Robert said.

SCHULTZY: "But we don't have shot at winning the conference anyway. We're clearly an inferior team to Baylor, OU, K-State, and TCU. We just happened to have the easy part of the schedule at the beginning, which I guess altered people's expectations of the program."

That does it for this weeks roundtable. Got a complaint, thought, idea? Share it with us in the comments! Go Pokes! BEAT WVU!